Saturday, February 23, 2008

What happens on their end of your interaction with a narcissist - Part 3

Last time I attempted to explain why narcissists interract with other people the way normal people interact with a mirror.

That's an abstract analogy that often goes over people's heads. But it's a fact with tremendous implications.

For example, let's say that you are a person with poor posture. Do you let that show before a mirror? No! Before a mirror you straighten up, don't you? Is that image of yourself you're projecting the truth then? Is that the real you? Of course not! The real you slouches. But so what? You're just posing before a mirror. The object isn't to show the real you: the object is to make your reflection as flattering as possible.

In interracting with you, a narcissist isn't expressing herself: since everything she does is solely for effect, truth is irrelevant.

To her, that is.

In fact, to be more precise, we don't interract with a mirror: we interact with our reflection in a mirror. Similarly, a narcissist isn't really interacting with you, she is interacting with her reflection in your behavior toward her. She's trying to adjust it, period.

In other words, she's trying to manipulate your behavior toward her.

Not just some of the time — all the time. In other words, you needn't be talking about her and trying to get through to her, trying to reason with her. You might be talking about the Mideast Crisis, your family budget, your kids, the garden, a customer satisfaction survey, what you had for lunch — anything. She isn't interested in any of it. She pays no attention to anything but the look on your face, the tone of your voice, your posture, gestures, and other things in your behavior that reflect (on) her. She just says or does whatever it takes to adjust those aspects of your behavior = to adjust her image in that mirror.

Typically, narcissists do this by showing disapproval of whatever you say to manipulate you into a posture that seeks their approval. For, that reflects on them as superior to you. Get it?

Hence the fact that narcissists are notoriously disagreeable people. That disagreeableness isn't genuine: it's just a ploy to manipulate you.

So, there you are, expressing yourself to a narcissist, and none of it is getting through. She ain't (all) there. She's reacting to some ghost. A ghost of herself reflected in your attitude.

Of course, she'd rather you shut up about the Mideast Crisis and just hang on her every word while she talks about herself ;-) And she will try to manipulate you into doing so by acting bored and cross if you don't. Like a Hollywood star, she expects you to reflect (on) her as being very, very important. She accomplishes the semblance of this by getting you to silently pay attention to her as if consumed with interest in every stupid thing she says and every minute and mundane detail of her daily life.

(Note the irony: who's the real bore?)

And the appearance of that is all she cares about, because she needs nothing but your silence to to support her delusion that she is so fascinating that you really are consumed with interest in every stupid thing she says. Yawn, sigh - there in the Land of Pretend she will unsee and unhear you do that. Put the phone down and do your dishes, speaking "Uh-huh" into it periodically. She will be completely satisfied, because that's all she needs to pretend that she's so grand that even her chatter is fascinating to mere mortals like you.

Indeed, what child needs a real car to pretend that he is driving a race car or a real gun to pretend that he is being a soldier? An overturned bicycle or a baseball bat held backward will do. Such is the power of a childish imagination and magical thinking.

To paraphrase Mark Twain, 'It's a terrible death, to be bored to death by a narcissist's talk.' If their empty life doesn't supply a grocery list and a list of this morning's errands to bore you with, they relentlessly steer the conversation to a subject you can't contribute to. Like the husband who goes on endlessly about car engines to a wife who doesn't know the difference between a distributer cap and a transmission. If that won't make you shut up and just listen (thus seeming to reflect an image of them as fascinating), narcissists get exhibitionistic. Like the Hollywood star on a late night talk show, who appears in a wild outfit and spouts every outrageous thing that enters her head, just to grab and hold the audience's attention.

This vain folly is more than a bore. It is another fact with tremendous implications.

In identifying with her reflected image in your reaction to her, the narcissist is identifying with a mere caricature of herself. A work of art, a figment of her imagination . . . there behind the Looking Glass.

She is living in a world fiction there. Which is why virtually nothing she tells you is true, at least not in the details, which she edits on the fly to reflect on her as flatteringly as possible.

Again, like a little child pretending that he is Superman.

And don't jump to the conclusion that a flattering reflection must be that of her as a good person. What it must be is grand. So, admiration isn't the only thing she loves to see in you. Shame before her is something else she loves to see in you, because it reflects on her as superior to you. The most flattering reflection of all is that of being powerful. Therefore, if you are someone she can treat like dirt, look out. Because you are just a mirror.

You must never forget this. Not for one moment. Every time you are face to face with a narcissist, all she's doing is manipulating the look on your face. She just says and does whatever it takes to put shame there. Or whatever it takes to put admiration there. Or whatever it takes to put sympathy there. And so forth.

Yes, even if you're her therapist and she's on your couch!

Don't assume that she cares about her SELF. How could she? She doesn't identify with her SELF: she identifies with her IMAGE, so all she cares about is that MIRAGE.

Therefore, even if you have caught her red-handed doing something despicable, or if she has been dragged into marriage counselling before you, the whole time she is doing nothing manipulating you for the best reflection she can get. Period. Usually one of sympathy for poor-little-her that blames the victim.

To that end, she rewards you for every right thing you say, for every bit of "understanding" you show. She gives you what you want when you do that and witholds what you want when you look favorably on her victim instead. So, if you're a bystander who wants to feel like a good person or a therapist who wants to feel like you're competent and getting anywhere with her, you had better ante-up what she wants. Get it, doggie?

She doesn't even see your face, just the look on it. That's because no one looks at a mirror; people look only at their reflection in a mirror. And that's what the narcissist is doing. That's why narcissists are notorious for not recognizing the faces of people they know, even members of their own family, when they meet them in an unusual place, such as on the street or in the grocery store.

So, you never connect with a narcissist. YOU are not even there to a narcissist. She isn't interacting with you: she's interacting with herself, with her reflected image in you. Because you are just a mirror.

Yell if you want. But that won't get her attention. She will just yell louder to drown you out. She will throw up all kinds of other flak too — anything to block you out. It's a distraction from the only thing she has eyes for: her reflected image in your reaction to her.

In other words, both your attention and her attention must always be all on her. She's desperate to have and keep it that way.

So, narcissism is all about attention, and she's gotta have it all. Her life is but a game of monopoly for it all.

What are you trying to discuss with her? Don't bother. Because, no matter what it is, she couldn't care less about it. She has a knee-jerk reflex to seize every opportunity to create a glorified reflection of herself in a mirror, and that's all her one-track mind cares about.

Is she after an admiring look from you today? Then she is just playing you for one. If that requires her to be a Republican, she'll be a Republican. If that requires her to be a Democrat, she'll be a Democrat. And if she finds that she guessed wrong, she can switch political parties in two seconds flat.

She loves her reflection in your look when she has made you feel inferior to her. That is why she manages to work a put-down into everything she says and does.

Because you are just a mirror. And her image is all that matters to her.

That's all there is to narcissists. They are that shallow.

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At 5:53 AM, Anonymous holy water salt said...

Wow. Dead on. I used to feel I must be boring to them (there's a few) b/c I couldn't compete in the conversations...I didn't know about astrophyics for example...I mean this went on for over 2 years...

And not just one person, but a few. I had a cloud of these folks..This is shocking.

They would lecture--one wanted to become a prof. I guess so they could just talk at people,,,explains why most classes suck and the really great profs. are few and far between.

You nailed this--by the way, I have been feeling better by leaps and bounds...I know part of my recovery is reading this blog.
Thank YOU

At 7:15 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fantastic artikels Kathy, very clear and exactly corresponding with what I expirienced.
It's almost psychotic but it's not.
There reality-testing is intact.
They proof this when you confront them with their lies and generely the falseness of their image: they fight whith all means to stop you in a very rational and calculated way.
A psychotic couldn't do that.
This means they know they are lying and they no they are fake.
And then they know what terrible things they are doing as well.

I sometimes wonder how it stays possible for them to live, knowing this all.
They kill their very soul.
And they know it.
What a price to pay..


At 7:58 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hi Kathy,
Great post, thank you.
It helps to remind me why the most important thing to get into your head when dealing with an N is
because any contact can ONLY be used by the N to get a favourable reflection of himself - NOTHING ELSE .
And that is what I think causes so much devastation for the victim. It is only natural to want the N to acknowledge that he has done wrong or even to acknowledge that you were hurt by his actions. The mind of an N is not capable of this, so you can contact him as much as you want but you are never going to get that. Every contact is simply an opportunity for him to use you some more. In fact, it is a big mistake to communicate your pain to the N, as this only has the effect of renewing the high he got from his actions in the first place.
You find yourself in a very lonely place, especially since he has conned so many other people so that you cannot get any comfort there either.
NO CONTACT does not take away the pain, but it is essential to prevent any more s**t, and at least give you a chance to start dealing with it.
Kathy, by telling us what is going on in their heads, you give us the knowledge we need to do what must be done.

At 8:31 AM, Blogger Kathy said...

Gerard, that must be why when abandonned by all their mirrors and besieged by self-awareness surfacing to consciousness on them, they contemplate suicide.

Anonymous, agreed about NO CONTACT.

If that is really absolutely impossible, then as close to total no contact as possible.

In fact, talk therapy is a waste of time and counterproductive too.

The only thing I can think of that MIGHT help would be in-patient treatment for a long time under a strict regimin of positive and negative reinforcement for behavior modification. No talk - just WHAM - punishment for every wrong step and reward for every right step. Like housebreaking a puppy.

But even that may not work. In fact, I suppose it could batter down their defenses and make them a suicide risk.

Whatever. Narcissists are not the ones I care about. Their victims are. We all deserve to be free of the stumbing block OF THEIR GUILT they lay on us.

At 9:14 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I found out about N.P.D. when I started searching the internet for explanations for someone's behaviour.
It did not take long before ( like many people ) I got that "light switching on" moment - everything could be explained. It takes a lot of reading and thinking to come to some sort of understanding of N.P.D. and I still think back to the days when I was ignorant. What really strikes me is the number of things that the N said that, at the time, struck me as odd, and as such stuck in my mind, but did not cause me any great concern. Now, I can see them as just obvious examples of what an N might say.
For example, he had just lost his job (again), and living with his new wife ( in her house) while she worked 2 jobs. Money was tight. He sat smoking a cigarette, telling me how he had been pointing out to his wife how much money they would save if SHE quit smoking! Shortly after that, he said in front of his wife and her friends that he always liked to have a couple of hundred dollars in his wallet in case he saw something he wanted. Her friends just looked at each other. But not I nor her friends knew to tell her RUN RUN RUN. But she would not have listened anyway.
The point I am making is that those people who do not have knowledge of N.P.D. ( i.e most people ) can spot these signs that there is something wrong with someone who is an N., but without that knowledge, they can only rationalise it in whatever way they can. With the knowledge, you can at least be alert to the possibility that here is a potential N.
When you read about N's and really understand it, it seems remarkable that they don't stand out like a sore thumb and should be avoided at all costs. But a lot of what they show is very subtle or not serious enough to cause great concern. They keep the big stuff well hidden.
Knowledge is the answer, so how do we make more people aware of this danger ? I really don't know.
I have talked with several people about N.P.D. and given them various sites where they could read about it, but it takes a lot of effort to study something like this. Maybe you have to be a victim before you have the motivation to spend the time and effort, certainly you have some experience which you can relate to what you are learning.
I have given up trying to point out to other people the numerous examples of N's behaviour that show what he is, but they just don't get it because they don't have the knowledge. They just find some other explanation that makes it easier for them, and if not, the N will do that.
At least we can all rejoice in the fact that WE HAVE THE KNOWLEDGE.

At 10:22 AM, Blogger Writer in Washington said...

Hi, Kathy:

I can't tell you how much I agree with the previous poster. I didn't start to clue into NPD until I began to do research as the result of interactions with my husband's ex/daughter/son. Your site was the first one that really made sense and where I began to understand that what I was thinking wasn't crazy at all. BTW, before they divorced my husband and his ex went for pastoral counseling. She went in alone and had the pastor totally convinced that she was the innocent victim. When the pastor confronted my husband, he went home and pulled out the documentary evidence of her multiple and currently ongoing affairs and showed it to him. The pastor was flabbergasted! After more than 30 years in the ministry he'd been completely bamboozled by her. Your detailing of the game they play with counselors is absolutely right on the $.

At 10:23 AM, Blogger Writer in Washington said...

PS: The daughter is an air traffic controller now, but she plays the clutzy dumb blonde to perfection. And you are also right on about the conversation always having to revolve around her. Whatever you said to her, she would somehow turn the conversation to center on herself.

At 12:06 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

One reason why it's so difficult to recognize narcissists (and abusers in general) is because doing so requires pattern recognition skills, applied to people's behavior, over time.

Blogs like yours, Kathy, and Anna's (Narcissists Suck) are a rich, rich source of information on these behavioral patterns and on what they mean. No sugarcoating, no pulled punches. Facts, case studies, clear portrayals of how abusers behave, how abuse escalates over time, how lying and dissimulation are an essential part of the emotional predation involved.

But pattern recognition isn't taught in schools. You won't find people discussing it on the street. In fact, in my experience, applying pattern recognition skills is discouraged, if anything. It makes people uncomfortable. It's often lumped in with prejudice, which is not pattern recognition at all, but rather 'pattern fabrication'!

And, not coincidentally, the act of recognizing the patterns - and proceeding accordingly - is often disparaged as 'labeling'. This seems to be a schooled response, advocated especially strongly by - surprise! - people who make their livings by labeling others. This gives off a very strong aroma of racket-protecting, aka, "Trust (give your money to) us, we're the experts, and you're incapable of ever understanding these difficult things. "

The DSM, the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, is literally CRAMMED with pattern after pattern, laid out in precise detail. Anyone who finds themselves stymied by the unloving behavior of someone they love should consider taking a look through the DSM.

It may seem sad that some of the people we have cared about and suffered for - the narcissists/abusers in our lives - actually seem to be operating 24/7/365 under a set of programming rules, and those rules are laid out, in detail, right there on paper in the manual. But we need to know this, and we need to know what those rules are.

Knowledge is power. And there's also plenty of knowledge right here in pixels on this blog, and Anna's, and others.

We absolutely have to learn how to see these behavior patterns, and we must learn to trust our own judgement when we become able to see them. Nobody has the right to tell us that we should not have or don't deserve this knowledge.

(Historical note - and another pattern. 150 years ago, it was illegal in many US states to teach blacks how to read. And several more centuries back, teaching women to read was equally frowned upon, more or less universally. And for centuries, church services were conducted only in Latin, the Bible was published only in Latin, and most of the congregation did not even know that language.

There have always been those who prefer to keep essential knowledge to themselves, as a way of maintaining their power. We must learn to see this pattern too. Our lives may depend upon it.)

At 12:47 PM, Blogger Kathy said...

One reason why it's so difficult to recognize narcissists (and abusers in general) is because doing so requires pattern recognition skills, applied to people's behavior, over time."

What terrific piece! Thanks for the link. It's going in the sidebar.

At 3:13 PM, Blogger sonicido said...

A friend of mine gave me a great insight: "Everything is in Divine Order". Whether or not we give God credit for that is another subject. However, we all must admit that there are things going on in this world that even if we have knowledge about it, we can not intervene.

I say this, because I have found myself in a fantasy world where "everyone knew and acted" to stop these people from their oppressive ways.

However, it is rather frightening to imagine X-number of Malignant N's running around with no place to invest their evil. Would it make them even more evil?

I am NOT saying that I'd ever stop announcing the importance to be aware and to act-I am just saying that everything is in Divine Order-and we can only do the best that we can.

Thank you for helping us all, Kathy. I know the enormous amount of time that you dedicate with very little in return.

At 4:13 PM, Blogger Kathy said...

""Everything is in Divine Order". Whether or not we give God credit for that is another subject."

So God is responsible. He did it by Presidential order. I'd call that blame, not credit.

Consider how that makes those God didn't save feel.

I don't want to be on the receiving end of orders like that. I really wonder why it's just OK for God to help some innocent people and not others. Don't they pray hard enough? Punishment, maybe? For other people's sins? Maybe the sacrificial lambs don't like that idea.

At 5:26 PM, Blogger sonicido said...

Divine Order only means that there are things that I can not control, so I don't stress myself over trying.

The things that I can control-I'm very thankful for :)

The infinite question will always be, "Why me?"

At 5:37 PM, Blogger sonicido said...

Oh, I did want to thank Anonymous for Anna's link. Maybe now I can educate myself about that issue-and sort out some of the Divine/not so Divine things going on in my life!

(I've been pretty angry with God at times; and why not? if I am going to acknowledge and thank Him for good, then I can not-as I have tried-ignore that he has power over the bad)

I tried to throw Him out with the bathwater-the evil in my life-but so far He has clung to me and not let me go.

At 5:38 PM, Blogger Kathy said...

"Divine Order" means "Divine Order." That means ordered/ordained by God.

How does this metamorphose into 'people getting stressed out about things they can't control'?

That dodges my point.

At 5:38 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

""Everything is in Divine Order". Whether or not we give God credit for that is another subject."

I feel, that a lot of people who are believers use God to be not reponsibel for their own deeds i.e. thoughts...
I don't want to offend anyone, but we, ourselves are responsibel for all our actions, love, caring etc. An N.for example is not created by God, but by human beings and cultivated by human beings, so therefore has to be dealt with by human beings. Everything,(good or bad) in my opinion, comes from without ourselves, period. If you're a good person, you will do good, if you're bad or even evil, you will do that. It has nothing to do with God.

How come that so many spiritual leaders whether they are christians or whatever religion, are N's?


jt B

At 5:57 PM, Blogger sonicido said...

Kathy-I'm not completely sure (I haven't focused on studying this yet) all I know is that I love knowing that I am not responsible to control all the N's in the world. It's a big job for a bigger being than myself :)

Anonymous, all your points are also well taken. Thank you for giving me more to chew on ;) I'm still trying to figure out if some are born that way or made that way! I mean we KNOW some are made that way-but are they all? could some of them get "it" genetically?
I don't think anyone has the real answer yet-but if we don't keep asking how will we ever be sure?


At 6:01 PM, Blogger sonicido said...

"How come that so many spiritual leaders whether they are christians or whatever religion, are N's?


It is scary! I was there, right in the midst of them! and married to one!
Since being "aware" however, I have found them in the legal system, medicine, schools-now that is even MORE scary!

At 6:34 PM, Blogger Kathy said...

Who does think it's their job "to control all the narcissists in the world"? You imply that someone is doing that.

Who? And on what basis?

There is no evidence that NPD is genetically caused. See Is NPD Genetically Caused?

At 11:18 PM, Blogger sonicido said...

Now-a-days, I hash every possible angle to every issue.

Sorry if I implied.

Soni :)

At 10:44 AM, Blogger Kathy said...

Thank you. I appreciate that. And if you didn't mean to, I am sorry that I misunderstood.

As for the issue, it hit the big time back when I was still a believer, when Reggie White attributed everything, including the Green Bay Packers' Superbowl Championship to God's will. How inconsiderate of him to tell all those players from other teams that God plays favorites and acted against them. Why did they bother to play if God was against them and on Green Bay's side?

Is that fair? What's the point of playing the game then and trying to win: with God on the other team's side it ain't a level playing field.

Surprise, Reggie never looked at it that way, I'm sure. It's a simple matter of putting yourself in the other guy's shoes and then listening to yourself.

From there, what Reggie said doesn't sound so good.

That doesn't tend to make these other guys love God, does it? According to Reggie, he takes sides among his children and plays favorites.

The same thing happens when someone crawls out of his storm cellar after a tornado passes and claims that God saved him. What a spear through the hearts of the people next door whose baby was killed! That was God's will then too, right?

It comes off as gloating (about being somehow special to God) when your baby died in that tornado.

People find it hard to love a God who wills that others are saved while their baby dies.

If they viewed it as misfortune, they could accept it. But when you make it God's will, that changes everything. Then they want to know why God didn't save their baby too. How inconsiderate to thus tell them that God plays favorites and let their little baby die. That will undermine their faith in him.

Of course they are essentially asking, "Why me?" But replying with the dodge that this will always be the question is NO ANSWER to it.

Just as dodging the "question of evil in the world" by saying that "there is no answer" IS NO ANSWER.

There need to be answers to these questions that challenge the very basis of religious belief.

At the time many Christian theologians spoke up against Reggie and this type of remark, saying that such "praise" of God actually doesn't praise him at all, that instead it presents him as responsible for the bad things that happen and as unfair.

They also pointed out that this also makes God THEIR servant instead of the other way around. They pointed out that this incorrect belief is often used as a reason NOT TO ACT against evil on the premise that God will take care of it for you. That IS making God your servant.

Not all Christian theologians of course - but many said this.

I know that it's so customary to thank God for your salvation in such circumstances that most people who do it honestly don't intend to hurt those not so fortunate. Indeed, I myself had never done it, but the offense in it had gone right over my head till the day Reggie White embararassed me that way (as a Packer fan). Then suddenly I saw what is wrong with it. So, I know that is innocently done, as a sheer matter of custom. Most believers simply have never thought about it before.

I did think about it and came to the conclusion that no one should believe or claim anything that will tend to drive a wedge between others and God. That all claims should tend to draw others nearer to him. That no one should tell others anything about God that they wouldn't be glad to say about their beloved mother, as a way to make others love her too.

This question isn't my problem anymore, but that's the conclusion I came to when I was a believer. I think it is something for believers to think about.

After all, we have a mob of believers telling us that God favors them and wants them to kill us infidels. If that isn't blasphemy (giving God a bad name), I don't know what is. And it's done in the name of praising and glorifying their God. If I were their God, "praise" and "glory" like that, I wouldn't want. In fact, I'd be enraged by it.

At 11:44 AM, Blogger sonicido said...

Hi Kathy :)
I TOTALLY agree to your last statement here!!! The rest of it I'll have to take a lot of time to read and consider. Thank you for being solid and truthful about your experiences and views.

I HATE wishy-washy!

Like I said before, I can't get rid of God (I've tried HARD); I only want "mankind's" idea of God as far away from me as possible.

I'm heading out to go cut a friend's hair and then come back and start studying the rest of your book and your blog.

You are an unusual, and inspiring soul.

Soni ;)

At 5:55 AM, Blogger Di said...

This blog entry really resonates with me. My N ex-husband played squash three times a week, and after every match I had to sit and dutifully listen to a (quite literally) shot-by-shot account of the match.

Imagine it - '..I hit it high to the back and he returned it fast and low, so I lobbed it......' for half an hour or more.

When I once tried, when he paused for breath, to talk about my evening with our two very young children (James is running a temperature and Peter fell out of bed, or some such thing), I was shouted down with 'Don't interrupt me. Anyway, he hit it back wide and low and I .......'.

Unbelievable. It was over a year after that I finally left him, and about 4 years after that that I discovered NPD.

Interestingly, between those two events (the leaving and the discovery) I became involved with another man who had strong N tendencies. He did this as well. He once went to a Chinese restaurant where the chef cooked the meal in front of the diners, and later that night I got a detailed description of every step of the preparation ('he added the chicken and fried it some more, then he added the mushrooms', etc, etc). This took about half an hour. My attempts to join in the discussion and talk about my evening were brushed aside impatiently.

The next night the description of the meal was repeated, word for word. When I tried to point out that I'd already heard it, I was told I was selfish and didn't show any interest in his life and just wanted to talk about myself. He never did ask about my evening, he was just not interested.

Thankfully I've now learnt a lot about these type of people and now know to run in the opposite direction when I see one.

Even better, my normal, healthy second husband can recognise one even faster than me. He doesn't call them N's though, just a$$h%les (pardon the language).

At 10:47 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

someone can finally understand the picture of the jigsaw puzzle i put together - kathy, awesome job!

finding someone who really understands and puts the blame where it belongs is the key to healing -

my example of the mirror?

five years of begging my wealthy N to make my young son and i a "full part of his life."

five years of breakups when he didn't, his promises to change, my taking him back.

one of the million issues? he would constantly go on extravagant vacations but never, in five years, took us. he would often say "you don't deserve to go."

i left him many times because of it. he cried and promised he would never do it again.

but, of course he did. but he would always twist it to leave a hair of doubt that something i did messed up his promise.

this last time, ONE DAY after promising he would never do it again, he told me he was going on his 1000th ski trip to vail during Easter, where his mother and father have a vacation home.

but - to reflect back onto himself this time as a good guy - he told me he had good news for me and my son!

he would give us $1,000 to go on vacation ourselves, and he would go again to his vacation home in vail without us.

"i don't want you to go!" he told me.

so his "love" for us is now reduced to paying us so he doesn't have to suffer being with us.

he was shocked at my reaction.

now he can tell people how i didn't appreciate him wanting to send my son and i on vacation! maybe he will tell them $1,000 wasn't enough. poor guy!

when he looks in the mirror and sees a dirty face, he washes the mirror.

if it is still dirty, he pays it to stop reflecting back his dirt.

who says money can't buy happiness?

At 12:36 PM, Blogger sonicido said...

Hi Anonymous 10:47 :)
You said:
finding someone who really understands and puts the blame where it belongs is the key to healing -

When I did a study on pharmaceuticals, for a college class in 2004 I found out that 90% of depression (that has to be treated with medication) was brought about by injustice inflicted upon the person who reacts by becoming depressed. I wish I could find that link. Anyway, most of these people do not have anyone who "understands" much less can defend them and their rights. Two common reactions to unjust inflictions upon the victims: serial killing and/or depression & suicide.

So, yes. This site and Kathy are truly a treasure.

Also, I must say, that according to my own experiences (forced upon me by my fraudulent ex) poverty sure doesn't buy happiness either. :(

Hugs and best wishes!

At 3:44 PM, Blogger Kathy said...

"When I did a study on pharmaceuticals, for a college class in 2004 I found out that 90% of depression (that has to be treated with medication) was brought about by injustice inflicted upon the person who reacts by becoming depressed."

Yes! I had always suspected that. That makes the cure for depression = getting rid of the oppression.

But instead we just drug the victim to make the corpus delicti of wrongdoing go away.

I'm not saying that medication is never in order, but it ain't the cure because it doesn't get at the cause.

If you ever do find that link, I hope you post it.


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